{"id":7241,"date":"2023-11-13T10:28:05","date_gmt":"2023-11-13T09:28:05","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/bodhicharya.org\/manyroads\/?p=7241"},"modified":"2023-11-16T10:56:14","modified_gmt":"2023-11-16T09:56:14","slug":"anne-katrin-interview","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/bodhicharya.org\/manyroads\/anne-katrin-interview\/","title":{"rendered":"Anne Katrin Voss: Interview"},"content":{"rendered":"
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\"\"<\/a><\/div>\n<\/div>\n

\u00a0<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Can you tell us about yourself and briefly about your background in education?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Well, a lot of people ask me why I usually wear orange or purple clothes and a lot of people ask me whether I had been an Osho follower: I never was actually. As you can see behind me, there are two paintings at my back, the orange and purple paintings there. That\u2019s why I wear those colours. Because I studied art. I started at the Academy of Fine Art in Dusseldorf, which is pretty well known in Germany, and the paintings are by a painter from Munich, Rupprecht Geiger<\/a>.\u00a0 \u00a0His sunsets are abstract. I really like them so much. They are expensive though. So one day I thought: \u2018OK, I cannot buy the paintings but I can at least take the colours.\u2019\u00a0 That’s why I started wearing all those orange and red, all those bright colours.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

That’s the background. And about myself, I\u2019ll turn 70 this year. We have one daughter and two grandsons.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

I studied fine art, I studied English and I am the generation of teachers who were pretty well trained, but never got a job in school. When I was 45, I finally got a job at a school, which I liked very much. It was adult education at a night school. We had students from more than 50 nations at our school. And I really enjoyed teaching people from all over the world. Some of them had experienced difficult situations in their families and left school when they were young adults. Others were refugees and trying to get back into schooling in the German system; and yeah, it was very nice, but some of them were very troubled persons. And then I realised how being in a troubled situation influences your capacity to learn. <\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

It happened when one day it dawned on me that some who were not capable of learning the English past tenses while I worked on English grammar might need a different approach. So I gave it a try with so-called constellation work, which originally is a kind of therapy where you describe your inner pictures of how relations are, and these inner pictures can be staged in a room. I realised those who were not capable of discerning the past tenses might be traumatised, with very difficult families or experiences they had had while being refugees. As a teacher, I never felt I was qualified to treat them: that would simply not be part of the role of a teacher. But I realised that when I managed to make their bodies understand the grammatical structure of past tenses: afterward they could work with those. And I realised it only worked when I moved the person away from the past. Still, it was working on grammar only. When I realised that, I started to think about how I could support them in a different way. <\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>So using the past tense was bringing them to their past trauma?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Well, if you have a trauma, when you are influenced by it, it’s very close to your present. It’s right there, although they would never talk about it and they would never realise it is that close. But in constellation work, you can see the past and allow space between past and present. It helped them in their everyday life, too. So that’s how I understood their experiences and realised something about their situation. Of course, I also realised that being a teacher, I could not mingle with roles. I’m not a therapist.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>As you quite rightly say, you cannot mix the role of the teacher with the role of the therapist: there are very good reasons for that. But you wrote a book, On the Trail of Happiness<\/em>, which is about educating children about happiness. How did you come up with the idea of writing that book?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Well, because of my experiences in adult education, I had already written two books for young adults from the experience of teaching, How to Live a Happy Life<\/em>, so I could support my adult students. And then the editor of the first two books, which are best sellers in Germany, asked me: “Could you do something for younger students?”I hesitated because I was teaching in adult education. but I had thought about it for a long time and also watched my grandsons and my nieces and nephews. I thought, ‘Well, yes, yes, I will make an attempt’. So I wrote the book we are talking about now, ‘On the Trail of Happiness’. In the meantime, all the employees at the editor had changed and the new ones said: “Ah, no, we are not interested in this kind of lessons anymore, we are only interested in mathematics and informatics and all those technological subjects.” But, in the end, the book was finished anyway. And I even had the enormous privilege to get a foreword from His Holiness Dalai Lama. In the end, I decided: I wrote it, it\u2019s finished and now I just want to give it for free. It should not just stay on my computer, with nobody able to work with it. I know how difficult the job of a teacher can be, especially if you want to introduce something new besides all the work you already have to do. So, the idea was to give it for free for whoever wants to use it and might find it a little help.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>You mentioned the wonderful introduction by the Dalai Lama that you’re so grateful to have; and I understand that you also met the Dalai Lama at a conference in Washington, which was titled Educating World Citizen for the 21st Century<\/em>. Can you say more about the conference and the meeting with the Dalai Lama?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Well, I didn’t meet the Dalai Lama in person at that time, but he was there. He was leading a conference of the Mind & Life Institute<\/a><\/em>.<\/strong> The headmaster of our school allowed me to fly to Washington and participate in that conference. Just to meet other people who were working on an ethical and alternative idea of education.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Can you say more about the conference?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Well, I was just sitting in the audience. But it was highly inspiring to see all those people all over the world making lovely attempts at preparing an education so that students could enjoy life, act ethically, and learn easily. I could see I was not alone, not the only one.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>His Holiness Dalai Lama often talks about mental hygiene in education, and learning how to deal with emotions. I remember once I watched a video of His Holiness talking to students in India. He complimented them on embracing sciences, technology, and modern subjects, but he also reminded them of the great tradition they have in their own country in terms of mind sciences. He was recommending them not to lose that, to embrace the new technologies and the new ways of education, and at the same time nurture their traditional culture. As a Westerner, is there any tradition we should refer back to? Or, is it more about learning this \u201cmental hygiene\u201d from the Asian traditions?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Well, of course, we have. We had movements for ethical training within the Christian Church. But to give a context, I had quite a lot of Muslim students, students from all over the world, some Christians, some without any religious background. So I tried to take away all the religious aspects and offered my training like little tasters, little bits of nice and tasty food, offered on a plate.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

I had this idea of offering experiences from many different traditions to my students so that they could decide what would be the one they felt at home with, and they would continue with it in their everyday lives. So answering your question, yes, we had those contemplative traditions in Europe, of course, with contemplative monks and nun orders; but they’re not any more well-known to the wider audiences. For example, when I was a child in Bavaria in the 1960s, nuns and monks could be seen all over the place. They were part of everyday life. It looked like they represented a sort of different choice a person could take, but completely separate from mainstream society.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Talking about contemplative traditions, there’s a lot of talking about mindfulness now in the West with the mindful movements, secular mindfulness teachings, Buddhist Buddhist-related mindfulness. But your book is about happiness. In On the Trail of Happiness<\/em>, you talk about happiness, how to relate positively to your emotions, and mental hygiene His Holiness is mentioned. Are we talking about something different when we talk about mindfulness or education for happiness? How do the two go together in your view?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Yes, I think mindfulness can be part of it. You don’t have to call it happiness. It\u2019s more a kind of inner calm. And lately, it seems mindfulness has been more and more turned into a commercial offer. That is not what I attempted with my students. It’s not about training people to be good employees or to be always mindful. What I realised is, that a happy person, a person who has this inner happiness or calm or whatever you call it, this person would not attack another person too much. So maybe you could say that I had in mind something like training for peace, for a peaceful life. And only if you have this within yourself, you can communicate with others in a friendly and peaceful way. There are always two huge steps, the first step is how to be kind to yourself; and the second step is how to find methods, tips, and tricks to be kind to other people.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Your book is a collection of practical activities to teach about happiness or peacefulness, as you said. What is the activity that you like the most in your book?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>I love the sound-related activities. When you listen to something rolling on the floor and listen to the sound getting lower and lower and lower till the limit of what you can hear.\u00a0 Of course, also is an exercise in mindfulness. Or listening walks which a pupil can do by walking from the family home to school: what does the door sound like when you close it? Do you walk down steps until you’re on the road? What is the noise of the road? What are the noises out there? Exercises like that. Because in a way your attention is pointed outward, using your ears, but you’re very much with yourself at the same time. <\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Would you tell us more about this choice of structuring the book in a very practical way? <\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>In the first version I had almost one-third of the volume with additional theoretical parts, but I skipped that because I know that most teachers, especially when it will be British teachers, have their own pedagogical theory, and that might differ from German pedagogic. So my idea was that it should be as practical as possible, as easy to handle by fellow teachers: just take the page and use it. When I was developing those exercises within adult education, I had the great chance to work together with a fellow teacher who’s a doctor in philosophy.\u00a0 Of course, we discussed a philosophical background: but for the book, a more practical approach seemed more appropriate.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>The book is currently in German and will be published for free. Will it be available in English?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>It will be available in English hopefully by the end of the year.\u00a0 Also, it seems that it will be available in Portuguese!<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Your activities are influenced by your Buddhist practice. Can you say more about your relations with Buddhism? And also, on the other side, how working with these activities with pupils have influenced your Buddhist practice?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Actually, my husband and I heard about Buddhism for the first time in 2002 when we accompanied a close relative who was dying. We realised that in Western societies there is very little knowledge about the process of dying, and we stumbled on \u201cThe Tibetan Book of Living and Dying\u201d \u00a0by Sogyal Rinpoche and found some very helpful ideas. So after her death, we went to a teaching of Sogyal Rinpoche and joined Rigpa, for some years. And then I realized that I would prefer another teacher because Rigpa was so huge at that time.\u00a0 I felt lost. By chance, we met Ringu Tulku Rinpoche in Glasgow in 2004, when His Holiness Dalai Lama was teaching.\u00a0 Immediately I knew, ” Yeah, he is the one.” He is such a warm-hearted, humorous, intelligent, and genial person.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Before I had met Marshall Rosenberg<\/a>, an American psychologist who set up Non-Violent Communication. He also felt close to Buddhism, so it all came together and later I interpreted Marshall Rosenberg for quite a lot of years. I also did this for Insoo Kim Berg<\/a> and Steve De Shazer<\/a>, who designed Solution Focused Brief Therapy<\/em><\/a>. And Insoo, being South Korean, was Buddhist also, so it all came together actually. When working with young adults or in adult education and encountering some difficult personalities, I realised for myself that it was extremely helpful to take the attitude. “OK, you are extremely difficult: you must have some problems, be unhappy, or have experienced things that made you act like that.”\u00a0 That helped my understanding of them and also gave me an indication of how to stay kind and calm, which sometimes is a real challenge being a teacher. So it actually all came together. And I remember one situation sitting in Munster in Germany at breakfast with Ringu Tulku Rinpoche: I was so worn out from school and what he said was this short sentence: \u201cDon’t take it so seriously\u201d. So what I did, was write that on a paper and put it on the lower part of the bathroom mirror. So every morning when I brush my teeth, it’s there. I look at it and I remember; \u2018OK. Don’t take it so seriously and yes, it helped me a lot. I felt very safe in asking him how I could stay kind with my students.\u00a0 And that helped with the idea of creating a Mandala of respect in my classes, creating a mandala of respect and kindness. That was very appealing to me.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>I know the book is not being published. Are you aware of anyone that used some of your activities and have you had any feedback from other people on those activities being used?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Yes, I have received feedback from my former students; some of them I’m still in contact with, although I’ve been out of school for 10 years now. So I really get the feedback that it changed a lot in their life. It’s very nice. And when I look at the numbers of books sold, yeah, that’s a kind of feedback also.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>What else do you think would be nice to say? <\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Oh yes, there’s one thing: I’m extremely grateful to Ian Morris<\/a>, who is head of Well-Being at Wellington College. I heard about his teaching, and I wrote to him. And he freely gave me all his material. In the end, I couldn’t use it because my students were completely different. The British system is different in as far as you have state schools and public schools.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

In Germany, schools are open to everybody, which means you do not have schools that are focused on very high education. A school in Germany has a whole range of students of different capacities. I had to really design my own material, but Ian Morris being so open-hearted and so free giving it really gave me a lot of energy. So, thank you very much, Ian Morris, if by chance you read this.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>We’ll send him a copy of the newsletter!<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>And of course, there are so many other people who I’m just extremely grateful for.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>It was really pleasing to hear all your stories. There\u2019s a real feeling you’ve been very brave and energetic. You really reach out. You want to change. You don\u2019t sit down and wait.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Yes, I wanted to change. And not every fellow teacher is very pleased if you do that. Because when you stick your head out, there’s always a slight danger. I have a tendency to stick out my head and say: “I want a change”. I have this almost childish feeling to do things and \u2026 why not? Do it.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Why not? Reminds me of Rinpoche. [laughing out loudly]<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Yes, yes. [laughing loudly]<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Yeah, why not?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>I had a brief experience as a science teacher in England: what you need to do during your lessons is quite regimented. You need to have precise objectives in every lesson, the need to relate to the curriculum and the exams. If I think of the role of a science teacher, it would probably be difficult to get time for different activities. How would you suggest agreeing with your school the time for these kinds of activities on happiness?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>But I know that in the British system, you also have extra lessons in the afternoon, which we don’t have in Germany. In my case, the headmaster was open-minded enough when I told him: “Listen, I would like to do an experiment.”\u00a0 And I asked him for one year. In the beginning, I experimented in art lessons, as I was teaching art. I wouldn\u2019t have been given permission while teaching English, of course. We have to meet all the expectations, we have to prepare our students for exams, which is, I guess the same as you described it, but with the art lessons I was free. I was free enough to do it and I did it. In the beginning only with one group.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>How did you incorporate your activities within the art classes?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Well, usually I taught perspective, human figures, drawing, watercolour, and also art history. Those were the normal lessons. However, I got permission for just one experiment with one group. For two hours, once a week with one group.\u00a0 The outcome was so nice, that fellow teachers said: \u201cOh, they turned very friendly, so your lessons really showed.” They, the students, had turned more friendly with fellow teachers and they improved in their exams as well. And really it showed with the marks. So after this one year, I was permitted to continue with more groups.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Also, I could prove that from the semesters I was teaching we had a real tangible reduction of dropouts, which is a problem with adult education. You have a high number of dropouts usually, but from my semesters hardly anyone left and they also had noticeably better marks in the final exams.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

\u00a0<\/strong><\/span>Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Maybe the other part of the question is: if you are a teacher in any subject, English, Science, and so on, and you’re delivering your curriculum, you might find it difficult to incorporate these activities within that. But what advice would you give to any teachers to run their classes, whatever the subject, bringing that attitude of peace and mindfulness?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>I think most of the situations would permit them to sit in a group and just talk about how they feel at the moment, for maybe 10 minutes in the beginning, which with young pupils most teachers do anyway. And I started my other regular lessons with a very brief 10 minutes, no more, with a short weekly round: \u201cHave you experienced anything during the last week, that made you happy, that you succeeded in? Did somebody else do something nice?\u201d I formulated the questions extremely open-ended so that everyone could join. And it worked enormously well because what you have in the end is bringing together a bunch of positive experiences. It may take a little training for the teacher in the beginning. For instance, some students would like to talk for a long time, but that easily slows the discussion down. It just comes by doing it again and again. Also, some pupils do not want to say a word at all, but you\u2019ll find out that they will join at the right time for them.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>In a way, you’re in a privileged position because you can run these activities and at the same time you are a Buddhist practitioner: you practise mindfulness compassion, and positive emotions yourself. So I think that gives you a lot of experience and background to handle this kind of activity, the response from the students and so on. If you were to talk to a teacher who doesn’t have any mindfulness background, what would your advice be to train to handle these kinds of activities?<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Breathe! Breathe!\u00a0 Just this very, very simple activity. Actually, there is a breathing exercise from management training I used to do when I was working as a human resources manager: I call it three by three<\/em>. It’s about breathing as slowly as you feel. Breathing in, through the nose, breathing out, through the mouth, three times into your upper chest, three times into your stomach, three times into your lower abdomen. This actually is used in management training, when managers know, that it will be a very difficult situation or they are heading for a difficult task, this is so helpful. You can do it anytime. Waiting at the traffic light you can do this and it really brings down your whole body and mind. You can do it while waiting at the cashier in the supermarket. You can do it any moment when you have some free time. It’s short and it’s effective.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Michele<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Thank you. Thank you so much for sharing all this.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

Anne Katrin<\/span>
\n<\/strong>Thank you<\/em> so much.<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

\"\"<\/a><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\"\"<\/a><\/div>\n
Michele has been enjoying his slow walk along the Buddhist path since he met Dirk de Klerk’s Bodhicharya London group over 18 years ago, with Ringu Tulku Rinpoche being his main teacher. He built his career in IT consultancy and he is now taking a break to focus on more interesting activities. Michele had a brief experience as a teacher and is interested in education.<\/em><\/span><\/h5>\n
<\/h5>\n
<\/h5>\n
\"\"<\/a>Anne Katrin Voss, artist, teacher, constellation worker and author<\/em><\/span>* December 1953 in Flensburg, Germany<\/em><\/h5>\n
Married to Peter, a musician and sound researcher, with one daughter, and two grandsons.
\n<\/em><\/span>
\n1973 I studied Art and English at the Academy of Arts, D\u00fcsseldorf, Dep. M\u00fcnster, until I fell in love and moved to Leuven, Belgium.
\nThere I had one of the first organic bakeries in Europe (mainly Cakes).
\n<\/em><\/span>
\nIn 1981 I returned to Germany to finish university and take my final exams. Unfortunately, no teachers where hired in the 80s in Germany so I worked with big companies like SIEMENS and Philips in human resources.<\/p>\n

In 2004 I finally got a job as a teacher in adult education, which I really loved a lot.<\/em><\/span>Since 2015 I am retired and nowadays doing sound research (The Use of sounds in medicine and healing).<\/em><\/span><\/h5>\n

<\/h5>\n
\u00a0<\/em><\/span><\/h5>\n

 <\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

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